#IdleGirls for Browser 12/17/24 #Column [▼Poison] Analysis

【Before reading f-bra】
※Refer to the above if you are unfamiliar with the unique skill notation
2nd Reincarnation Lv42 (192) Faction: Campaign200・PvP
Secret Skill Unlocked: 88

【General】
Holy MRDaitengu (Re-release) <App Version> Holy MR


Odin (Re-release)

Since these are just re-releases, I would like to examine [▼Poison] in PvP, which now includes two characters with the addition of Lilith alongside Loki.

【▽Poison】 Summary

First, I would like to summarize what [▽Poison] is.
The following is verbatim from the game text.

Poison (Sin)
HP at time of status effect calculation - 3% of remaining HP. When a Beneficial or Holy status is applied, the application fails, turn count -1, remaining HP -3%. When stacked with Burn (Sin) status, status resistance is additionally -25%, and when a Beneficial or Holy status is applied, the application fails.

Since it is confusing, let's break it down.

• When applied to an enemy,

  • reduces remaining HP by 3% each turn upon acting (also reduces boss's massive HP by 3%)

  • buff inhibition (requires 1 turn reduction per instance)

    • reduces remaining HP by 3%

  • When applied simultaneously with [▽Burn] (cannot be used with [Burn]):

    • reduces debuff resistance by 25%

    • reduces remaining HP by 3% each turn upon acting

    • buff inhibition(requires 1 turn reduction per instance)

      • reduces remaining HP by 3%

With [▽Poison] alone, enemy buff application fails with "requires 1 turn reduction per instance," so you can inhibit 2 buffs in 2 turns.
With the [▽Poison]/[▽Burn] combo applied simultaneously with [▽Burn], the "reduces remaining HP by 3% when turn is reduced" effect is lost, but the condition of "requires 1 turn reduction per instance" for enemy buff application failure is also removed, allowing you to inhibit buffs infinitely even in 2 turns.
(In boss battles, since you want to turn one into a green buff and reduce HP by 6% with [Poison] and [Burn], they get in each other's way.)
However, if the debuff is cleansed, [▽Poison] will disappear regardless of how many turns remain.

* [Poison] and [▽Burn] do not have a buff inhibition function.

Summary of [▼Poison]

Morgan's opening [▽Poison] for 4 turns allows you to inhibit 4 enemy buffs.
However, it ends with a single debuff cleanse.

That is where [▼Poison] comes in.
Since it cannot be cleansed, you can reliably inhibit enemy buffs for the number of turns it lasts.
However, because there is a limit based on the number of turns, if it is consumed by a weak buff (for example, a weak buff like [△Spirit Light] which reduces strength damage by twice the intelligence value), the main target buff might not be inhibited.

Even with the [▼Poison]/[▽Burn] combo, it ends with a single debuff cleanse.

What has also appeared is the [▼Poison][▼50 Burn] combo.
If [▼50 Burn] resists debuff removal, it can infinitely obstruct enemy buffs.
If you successfully land the [▼Poison][▼50 Burn] combo at the start and resist debuff removal, the enemy might not be able to apply any buffs other than those that are "applied at deployment, cannot be removed."
([▼Burn] is Lu Xunonly. Described later.)

Currently, only Loki and Lilith are capable of this [▼Poison].

Relationship with [△Flower Words]

[▼Poison] is obstructed by [△Flower Words].
Buffs/debuffs at deployment are not simultaneous; the left side (attacker in PvP) goes first.
Therefore, if the attacker spreads [▼Poison], the right side's [△Flower Words] will be obstructed.
Conversely, if the attacker spreads [△Flower Words], the right side's [▼Poison] will be obstructed.

However, since [△Flower Words] also has a debuff obstruction of "1 turn reduction per instance," if the number of debuffs at deployment increases, it might not be able to obstruct them all.
(If so, stacking it with [Soul Fix] might draw attention.)

The terror of [▼Poison]

Unlike resurrection, debuff removal upon ignoring fatal damage cannot remove [▼Poison].
In other words, it can obstruct powerful buffs like [Shadow Armor] and [Thunder Armor] upon revival.
However, King Arthur's passive skill "When an ally is fatally wounded, ignore fatal damage & (up to 4) debuff turns -4" can remove [▼Poison].

Similarly, the skill 1 buffs of the enemy vanguard can also be obstructed by [▼Poison] at the start.
This can obstruct even non-removable buffs that are the trump card for that general.
While non-removable buffs are increasing to counter full buff removal, [▼Poison] is the only thing that can resist this.

Starting [▼Poison]

Among the terrors of [▼Poison] mentioned earlier, there are infinite patterns for application upon ignoring fatal damage, but since they are limited at the start, I would like to analyze the patterns.
(Assuming no fatal damage ignore in turn 1, and not considering [▼Poison] from counterattacks upon death.)

A common scenario is assuming Baize is in the enemy vanguard.
Skill 1

• To 6 allies

  • Remove 2 debuffs

  • Apply 1 weak buff

  • [▲50 Shadow Armor 4t]

• To 2 allies with high max attack: [▲50 Seven Stars 4t]

• To self and 3 allies with high HP: [▲50 Ice Armor 4t]

Baize's skill 1 applies 4 buffs after removing 2 debuffs.
I especially want to obstruct the two powerful ones in the latter half: [▲50 Seven Stars 4t] and [▲50 Ice Armor 4t].

• [▽Poison 2t] (▷ASun Shangxiang): Debuff removal for [Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼50 Poison2t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang + 50% debuff removal resistance): Even if resistance succeeds, [Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼Poison2t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang + Lilith): Cannot be removed, but [Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼Poison2t] (Loki): Cannot be dispelled, but [Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼Poison4t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang + Loki): [Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▽Poison 2t][▽Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang, ▷ASun Quan): Upon debuff dispel, [Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼50 Poison2t][▽Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang + 50% Debuff Dispel Resistance, ▷A Sun Quan): Even if resistance is applied, [Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▽Poison 2t][▼50 Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang, ▷A Sun Quan + 50% Debuff Dispel Resistance): Upon debuff dispel, [Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼Poison2t][▽Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang + Lilith, ▷A Sun Quan): Upon debuff dispel, [Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼Poison4t][▽Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang + Loki, ▷A Sun Quan): [Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼50 Poison2t][▼50 Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang, ▷A Sun Quan + Debuff Removal Resistance 50%):

  • 50%[▼50 Poison2t][▼50 Burn 2t] with [Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

  • 25% [▼50 Poison2t][▼50 Burn 2t] with[Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

  • 25% [▼50 Poison2t][▼50 Burn 2t]with[Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼Poison2t][▼50 Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang + Lilith, ▷A Sun Quan + Debuff Removal Resistance 50%):

  • 50% [▼Poison2t][▼50 Burn 2t] with[Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]([▼Poison 2t] maintained)

  • 50% [▼Poison2t][▼50 Burn 2t]with[Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼Poison4t][▼50 Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Shangxiang + Loki, ▷A Sun Quan + Debuff Removal Resistance 50%):

  • 50% [▼Poison 4t][▼50 Burn 2t] with[Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]([▼Poison 4t] maintained)

  • 50% [▼Poison 4t][▼50 Burn 2t]with[Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▽Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Quan + Lilith): [Weakened Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼Poison2t][▽Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Quan + Loki): With debuff removal, [Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

• [▼Poison2t][▼50 Burn 2t] (▷A Sun Quan + Loki, Heracles):

  • 50% [▼Poison2t][▼50 Burn 2t] with [Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor] ([▼Poison 2t] maintained)

  • 50% [▼Poison2t][▼50 Burn 2t] with [Weak Buff][Shadow Armor][Seven Stars][Ice Armor]

After [Burn] is removed, the [▼Poison] turn count provides support.

While Lilith alone can spread [▼Poison] at the start, compared to [▼Poison 2t] with ▷A Sun Shangxiang, Loki can achieve [▼Poison 4t] with ▷A Sun Shangxiang, and [▼Poison 2t][▽Burn 2t] with ▷A Sun Quan.

The lifespan of [▼Poison]

If you focus only on [▼Poison], it doesn't matter much when Loki or Lilith spread [▼Poison] (other than at the start).
This is because it becomes [▼Poison] regardless of who spreads it.

However, Lilith's [▼Poison] accumulates (up to 4), so it might not be wasted.
But in the current meta where spreading weak buffs is standard, the [▼Poison] turn count decreases rapidly, so it is subtle whether there is a timing for other officers' [▼Poison] to stack (other than Lilith's skill 1 immediately after the opening [▼Poison]).

Maintaining [▼Poison]

That said, if Loki or Lilith are not deployed, it won't become [▼Poison].
Lilith has "[☆Jade Wall] when damage taken exceeds 5% of HP," but whether this can be utilized depends on equipment.

In other words, maintaining [▼Poison] from the start requires significant resources.
Naturally, the same applies to [▼50 Burn].
Above all, the moment Loki or Lilith are defeated, [▼Poison] becomes [▽Poison] and is removed by debuff cleansing.

There is a school of thought that it's fine if they fall after spreading [▼Poison] at the start and disrupting the enemy's skill 1 buffs, but...

• Can they survive the first turn? (Zero awakening is possible if [▼Poison] is spread at the start via coordination)

• (If +5 awakening or higher) If they are forced to ignore lethality multiple times, the death counterattack [▼Poison] will be wasted at its maximum turn count.

• Will the [▼Poison] turn count last until the buffs you want to disrupt (due to the weak buffs spread by the enemy)?

• Will [Burn] be removed?

Unlike campaign buffers, it's not just a matter of spreading it and being done, so whether it's worth the low-cost operation is also up to luck.
(You might say that Lilith was written to be viable for low-cost operation, but that is for [★Soul Seal] operation with [▼Poison] as a bonus; it becomes different when considering [▼Poison] as the main focus.)
Of course, if you pour in resources, long-term survival becomes possible, but naturally, the allocation to other officers will decrease, and reliance on the already countered [★Soul Seal] will increase.

You cannot defeat enemies with [▼Poison]

You might think, "No, you lower the enemy's attack and defense with [▼Poison] and finish them off with [★Soul Seal]."
[★Soul Seal] damage bypasses defenses, so [▼Poison] doesn't have much impact, and countermeasures are already advanced.
Of course, enemy firepower also drops, making it easier to survive, but it's the same as "stalling."
The question is how to defeat the enemy during that time.

If you put Lu Xun in your lineup, you get [▼Burn], but the reason you don't see it often is that he cannot spread [Burn] himself, and [☆Illumination] is fragile with 65% damage reduction, so using resources just to make [Burn] unremovable and cutting into firepower slots leaves no way to defeat the enemy.

As I have already written, [▼Poison] is the only thing that can counter unremovable buffs.
For this reason, defeating enemies while stably maintaining [▼Poison] and the [▼Poison]/[▼50 Burn] combo is set at a very high hurdle.
Therefore, it can be said that it is for server maturity and spending tiers where resources can be allocated to officers other than the ace.