Dialogue of the Gods: A Collection of Interviews with Koichi Sugiyama

Even after making this post, more materials were found one after another. Therefore, I decided to restructure it and reorganize it chronologically. All the materials used in this post have been migrated to the [Complete Version] linked below, soif you arrived here via search, please take a look at the [Complete Version]🙇

From an era when game sounds were not recognized as music to the entrance theme for the Tokyo Olympics...
Koichi Sugiyama, the great man who elevated game music into a culture. I believe the origin of the many masterpieces he created lies in the fact that he was an extraordinary game freak. This time, I have collected as many of the interviews he left behind as possible.
I have added 'Another Dialogue of the Gods' with Yuzo Koshiro and others.

1. Dialogue of the Gods: Nobuo Uematsu

An overly luxurious dialogue between Sugiyama-sensei and Nobuo Uematsu. In 1993, both the Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy series were in their prime. Although there is an age gap like parent and child between the two, in their 60s and 30s respectively, it is clear that their conversation as game musicians was lively.
When I posted this on Twitter before, I received comments from many composers, including prominent professionals, saying, 'There is still much to learn' and 'I was impressed by the interaction between the two.'
Also, Sugiyama-sensei really loves games, doesn't he? It makes me happy just reading it.

Additional article: This is the first part of this dialogue

Additional article: Yuji Horii, the creator of Dragon Quest

I finally discovered the article of this dialogue that I really wanted to read. It is an article from July 1991.

Additional article: Mr. Shigeru Miyamoto

Additional article: Sugiyama-sensei speaks at length

An article from the August 1987 issue of Technopolis magazine, which had a reputation for interviews with game industry figures. He talks in quite some detail about memories from his younger days. What was shocking was that, despite it being shortly after the war, he submitted a “demonstration tape recorded in the style of a disc jockey” as his graduation thesis at the University of Tokyo. It was apparently published in the Todai Shimbun at the time due to its extreme rarity. As expected of Tokuma Shoten, which is strong in anime-related content, there is a mention of anime music. I am particularly impressed by "Space Runaway Ideon" and my favorite anime, "Cyborg 009 (2nd Series)." He says that the first game music he recognized was the masterpiece "Mappy."

There is also an anecdote about how his parents were fans of mahjong, and that was how they met. His love for games was inherited from his parents. The article is packed with valuable stories, such as memories of bridge taught by his father, and unusual incidents at bingo machines and casinos. At the time of this interview, he was apparently hooked on "Daisenryaku II." 1987 was the year when simulation games began to rise on PCs, which shows that he was always following the cutting edge of games.

His unwavering belief that games should be viewed as a comprehensive art form and that the development of game music leads to the improvement of game culture is consistent, and this article also concludes with that sentiment. What moved me was that, in response to the large number of elementary school students encountering music through the Famicom, he urged manufacturers to step up by saying, “I want you to have the awareness that games will influence the future of Japanese culture.” It has now become commonplace for children to encounter music through games. However, I believe we must not forget that Koichi Sugiyama's passion and efforts were the foundation for that.

Additional article: Dialogue with Satoshi Tajiri

Satoshi Tajiri is now known worldwide as a game creator and the father of “Pokémon”. This dialogue was conducted when he was at his peak as a game writer, his previous career. It is an article from February 1989, just before Pokémon was released. As a special feature before the release of "Dragon Quest IV: Chapters of the Chosen," this content looks back on the music of Dragon Quest I, II, and III. He reveals the secret story behind the composition of II, which was more pop-oriented, and III, which was more classical. What was impressive was that he cited "Battle with Ortega" as the only song he felt was a failure in III. He said this scene should have been a requiem. I certainly would have liked to hear a requiem version of "Battle with Ortega."

2. Playwright Shoji Kokami, a Dragon Quest fan

Although he comes from a different field than Mr. Sugiyama, they get very excited talking about niche Dragon Quest topics in this conversation.
The 'Game Drifting Chronicle' was a series hosted by Mr. Sugiyama. He interviewed quite a few people in the game industry, and I was deeply impressed by how he, arguably the oldest person in the industry, always showed respect to his guests. It was a wonderful series that captured the bond of 'loving games'.

In 1988, Shoji Kokami released a CD titled 'Vocal Version Dragon Quest III: And into the Legend...', featuring lyrics set to the music of DQ3. It was an energetic work born as a project for the radio show All Night Nippon, capturing the Dragon Quest boom of that time.
He mentioned receiving voice training directly from Mr. Sugiyama at that time, so this conversation might have been a result of that connection.

The cosplayers were not professional theater troupe members, but all listeners. He said he asked them to 'come dressed however you like on the day.' The lyrics were collected from 'people crazy about Dragon Quest' via the radio show. Mr. Kokami recalls that this song was a 'collaborative work by all the fans'.

Additional Article: Another conversation with Shoji Kokami from May 1989

Additional Article: The Forbidden 'Kuso-ge' (Trash Game) Conversation with Jun Miura

A conversation from June 1989. Mr. Horii himself used the term 'kuso-ge,' so it seems it was commonly used even by creators at the time.

Additional Article: Conversation with novelist Kyoji Kobayashi

October 1993 article

3. A debate with a young sound creator

Mr. Sugiyama was in charge of composition, adopting a division of labor where a specialist handled the programming. He described this as the relationship between a composer and a performer. It is said that the masterpiece Jesus was completed in that way. Sound programmer Takeshi Tomita refutes this, but... However, it is truly amazing that the maestro immediately replied,
That was an incredible game, when asked about the legendary bizarre games 'Ben Bero Beh' and 'Gonbei no Aimu Sori'. How knowledgeable is he about games? It is also impressive that he praised the sound source of Sega's Deep Scan. And his words, You cannot fool children, left a deep impression on me.

Additional Article: The Secret Story Behind the Production of Jesus

4. The Relationship Between Classical Music and GM

The Dragon Quest classical concerts have now become a permanent fixture. This is an interview article with Mr. Sugiyama, who served as the moderator in the very early days. He explains in detail the relationship between the Famicom's three PSG sound channels and classical music.
The second half also features a discussion about Angelus: The Devil's Gospel. You can feel his enthusiasm as he says, Let's master the PC-8801 Sound Board II. While Mr. Sugiyama is strongly associated with Dragon Quest, this shows that he also had a strong interest and passion for the latest game music technology and PC games of that time.

5. Performing Game Music with a Woodwind Quartet

A concert where game music scores were performed directly by wind instruments, based on Mr. Sugiyama's reasoning that
the sound of wind instruments is relatively similar to PSG. On the day of the event, there was also a dialogue with Shigeru Miyamoto, the creator of Super Mario. You must be curious about what was discussed. Mr. Sugiyama actively engaged in these kinds of experimental attempts. I believe this was because he had a desire to expand the possibilities of what game music could be. According to the release at the time, they performed 14 songs as a quartet, including the Dragon Quest series and the then-unreleased Super Mario 3. Thanks to Yoshino @ Federation for the information.

⑥ Aiming for a Revolution in Game Music

For the "NHK Symphony Orchestra Version: Symphonic Suite 'Dragon Quest III: And into the Legend...','" Sugiyama-sensei conducted the performance himself. This interview took place just before that recording.
Sensei stated, “I want to create game music that is like a drama. My goal is a revolution in game music.” Perhaps his baton was infused with his dream of elevating game music to the same level as film music, which has been established as a genre in its own right. And as for whether that revolution was truly achieved... that is something you all know better than anyone.
I heard you bought a Deep Scan arcade cabinet from Sega at this time! That thing is huge.

⑦ Game Music is My Vocation

As those reading this are well aware, Sugiyama-sensei began composing for games at the age of 55. He already had many achievements as a composer and was a figure who could be called a master. I believe we gamers must never forget the effort he put into further developing the culture of game music. It is deeply moving to read his comments about Ryuichi Sakamoto, who passed away in 2023.

⑧ Rock is for Shooting, Symphonies are for RPGs

An interview from the time of the Super Famicom version of the Symphonic Suite "Dragon Quest I & II." “Rock is for shooting and action games, while orchestras are for RPGs and simulation games.” This quote is quite memorable.
He also said, “Orchestral music is an intellectual form of entertainment, and I want to create music that stirs the human soul.” I believe this connects to his earlier comment about "game music that is like a drama." Sensei's music was like magic, sparking the imagination to create a story all one's own. Our souls were stirred by that drama.

⑨ A Century More Classical than Dragon Quest I

An article about the aforementioned Dragon Quest classical concert. It seems he felt that III had an image that was a century more classical than I.
Sensei served as the moderator at this event, and he introduced a performance of "The Carnival of the Animals" by giving it an RPG-like story. This also reflects his wish for children to develop their imagination through music.

Additional article: Released on October 5, 1986, the "Dragon Quest" Suite was a magnificent production, with composition and conducting by Sugiyama-sensei and performance by the Tokyo String Ensemble, composed of selected members of the NHK Symphony Orchestra. This is the interview article from that time.

"The moment I swung the baton and the sound resonated, I was deeply moved, thinking that game audio had come this far."
"It is pathetic for the music that is familiar to children to be so poor."

Even just from these words, one can feel how much Sugiyama-sensei loved game music. There are also other interesting stories about the composition of the original Dragon Quest.

⑩ Rampage in the Gandhara Animal Realm

Finally, here is a spin-off manga featuring Sugiyama-sensei.
"Gandhara: Buddha's Holy War" is a unique RPG created by a trio of talented individuals: Dynamic Planning manga artist Tadashi Makimura, renowned programmer Toru Hidaka, and Sugiyama-sensei.
Its biggest feature is that it is set in the Buddhist world, and Sugiyama-sensei goes on a rampage in the manga introducing it 🤣

Comments from the creators were published in the May 1987 issue of "Enix Tsushin."
Sensei was also in charge of sound effects. He mentioned that he was interested in expressing an oriental mood. It seems he incorporated Gamelan music (music from the Indian cultural sphere that spread primarily through Bali).

⑪ Another Dialogue of the Gods: Yuzo Koshiro

Reprinted from the 88MULTiⅡ blog "Japan Retro Game Magazine Research Society Digitization Department," thank you 🙇
A miraculous encounter with Yuzo Koshiro-sensei in 1992. Chronologically, I wonder if this was after ActRaiser, which shocked the industry. It is a wonderful piece that feels like he is entrusting the future of game music to the young genius Koshiro-san.
Even the great Koshiro-san starts off a bit nervous. However, it is clear that the two hit it off not just as game music composers, but also through classical music, game music concerts, and above all, as game freaks.
It is amazing how maniacal terms like Tomy's Pyuuta and Vectrex come up naturally between them. I was impressed by Sugiyama-sensei's words:
"Koshiro-san, you have eyes that look like they are good at action games."

https://retoge-mag.websa.jp/archives/321

⑫ Sugiyama-sensei appears in manga

In a 1990 article, there is a comment that he recently cleared the Game Boy game The Final Fantasy Legend. It is also surprising that he reads Famimaga every issue. Although the content is aimed at children, it explains the production process of game music in quite some detail.
"If you say you can't make music with three sounds, you're not a professional."
There is such a reliable statement. The latter part where he talks about his favorite game music is a must-see.

⑬ Sugiyama-sensei talks about Dragon Quest music

Thank you for reprinting this from the blog 'Japan Retro Game Magazine Research Society Digitization Department' by 88MULTiⅡ🙇
It is an article from 2000, but I really wanted him to compose up to Dragon Quest 100 and live to be 500 years old.
The words, 'The theme of Dragon Quest is love for humanity' and 'I want people to enjoy each scene along with the music,' are enough to bring tears to my eyes.

https://retoge-mag.websa.jp/archives/4311

⑭ Original pro-gamer declaration (with additional article)

An interview from 1992 for the Super Famicom version of 'Half-Minute Hero: Ah, World, Be Half-Minute...!!'.
"Eat as much delicious food as possible and listen to good music"
Truly wise words.

A conversation held in 1988 with author Genichiro Takahashi. He states that games are a comprehensive art form and discusses the necessity of the evolution of game music in relation to games and movies.

⑮ Welcome to the Sugiyama Collection

A column from 1990 titled 'Sensei's Game Boasts.' It is packed with treasure collections.
Atari 2600, Intellivision, Pyuta Jr., and Casio PV-1000—all items that enthusiasts drool over. And they are even in their boxes. There are even items from 'unknown manufacturers.' It is truly a game museum.
He also had deep knowledge of board games, and perhaps these aspects contributed to the depth of his music.

Additional Article: TV Game Museum Opened!

Article from February 1991

Additional Article: Dragon Quest Music Transcends Borders

From the April 1991 issue of MSX Magazine. He speaks passionately about the Dragon Quest performance by the London Philharmonic.

16. Album Advertisements and Materials

Enix Game Music
You can enjoy Sugiyama-sensei's earliest PC game music here.

Symphonic Synth Suite 'E.V.O.: Search for Eden'
An experimental work, but the music is a must-listen.

Dragon Quest Symphonic Suite

Koichi Sugiyama Game Music Collection
A collection of game music planned and supervised by Sugiyama-sensei himself. Features synthesizer arrangements.

Koichi Sugiyama's Great Game Music Exhibition

⑰ Ballet "Dragon Quest"

An article about the September 1995 premiere, an original production by the Star Dancers Ballet. The teacher's wonderful smile is memorable.
It is said to be a popular performance that has been held up to the present day in 2024. It was also performed in Shanghai in 2004 and Paris in 2019.
The story is an adventure tale about defeating the Demon King, inspired by the original game. Armor and swords bearing the Crest of Loto, as well as the Castle in the Sky and the Helm of Erdrick, make appearances.

⑱ Thank you, Teacher, what we can do for you.

Koichi Sugiyama's music will surely be listened to 100 years from now, along with the great games. However, the thoughts and feelings he poured into weaving this music... I feel it is the duty of those of us who experienced it in real-time to pass that on to future generations.
If a generation that does not know the teacher hears these songs, I want you all to tell them about Sugiyama-sensei, who loved the games more than anything else...I wrote this post with that wish in mind.