What Media Says When Talking About Readers - Content Marketing with Advertisers / Interview with Mr. Hirosawa of Kao, Part 2

Hello everyone. This is CCI Lifestyle Digital CONNECT.

In our previous post, we delivered the first installment of our "Content Marketing with Advertisers" series, which was the first part of an interview with Mr. Yu Hirosawa of Kao Corporation. This is the second part.

Following up on the previous discussion, in this second part, we will ask Mr. Hirosawa about themes such as the importance of media talking about their own readers, and what content media in the cookieless era means, and media facing their own advertising inventory.

<Guest Profile>

<Interviewer Profile>

"SNS alone" is not the deciding factor

Hirosawa: "This is a personal story, but today (the day of the interview), I had a yukke bowl at a newly opened yakiniku restaurant in my neighborhood for lunch.

The reason I ended up going into that restaurant was, I had seen flyers and signs in the local shopping street, but since it was a new place, the design of the signs and the content didn't really click with me, so I didn't feel like going in. Haha"

Funayama: "I'm curious why you ended up going in from that state. Haha"

Hirosawa: "One day, a gourmet account I follow on Instagram posted about that restaurant. They said it didn't seem to have any reviews on the web yet, but it was delicious when they went in. That piqued my interest a little.

However, I don't know that gourmet account person well, and I'm not a devoted follower, so I searched for the restaurant on Google. Then I found an article on a web media site introducing it as a hidden gem derived from a famous restaurant, and I became interested all at once.

In other words, the Instagram gourmet account post alone was not the deciding factor. It was thanks to the article that came up in my search that I felt like actually going.. No matter how many followers a gourmet account has, it's ultimately just a personal opinion, so it didn't lead me to trust it enough to go. However, it acted as a trigger that made me want to look it up, and as a result of searching, I arrived at a web media article based on proper reporting, learned detailed information, and ultimately made the decision to go.

It is difficult to measure such a behavioral path, but I think everyone has had a similar experience, haven't they?"

Funayama: "I've had similar experiences many times, so I understand well.

On the other hand, advertisers often ask for SNS measures aimed at 'buzz.' I think there are people who purchase products after seeing buzz-worthy content, but I think there are also many people for whom it is not the deciding factor, just like you, Mr. Hirosawa. As you mentioned earlier, I think searches on the web or SNS will happen after something goes viral. If there is information that increases reliability when searched, I think that will be the deciding factor. For cosmetic products, it's like checking reviews on @cosme or LIPS. However, I think

how to place reliable information is extremely important. And, I think reliability increases when that information is also disseminated outside of the owned site. I think one of the roles of content media is to be a receptacle for consumers"

How to talk about "readers"

Hirosawa: "Yes, I think so.

I think it's quite difficult to make advertisers believe in such a flow, but I think the media itself must believe in it first. However, I also get the impression that web media themselves are becoming unable to believe in such stories these days"

Funayama: "Why do you think that is?"

Hirosawa: "I believe that media representatives should firmly explain to advertisers during business meetings, 'This is the kind of reader we have.' This isn't just about profile information like 'many women in their 20s' or 'many housewives.' While such general trends are important, I think it is necessary to talk about them in a way that allows for a concrete image of what kind of readers they are, including qualitative aspects like their lifestyle, consumption habits, and personality."

Funayama: "That is certainly true.
When I made proposals to advertisers, I talked more about the readers in detail than the media itself. In many cases, advertisers were more pleased with those kinds of proposals. First, I would talk about the analysis of reader behavior, and then we would discuss what kind of content should be created."

Hirosawa: "However, I feel that the ability to talk about readers in that way is weakening in web media."

Is web media losing its ability to talk about its readers?

Funayama: "When do you feel that?"

Hirosawa: "When I ask web media representatives during business meetings, 'What kind of people are your readers?', the first thing they return with is demographic data like that obtained from Google Analytics. However, if the media kit is published on the media's website, I have already checked the rough data in advance, and there are also external web analysis tools, so I can find out if I look. My intention when I ask 'What kind of people are your readers?' is a question about a more concrete reader image. For example, episodes from when they actually met the readers, or stories about how readers gave such-and-such feedback on published content. Quantitative data is important, but you can't see the reader profile with just that, can you?"

Funayama: "So, the reader persona is not being discussed, is that it?"

Hirosawa: "Yes, that's right.

It is of course important to present reader demographics based on data, but that is the minimum necessary information. I think one of the things that determines the character of a medium is the preferences and behavior of its readers, but it seems that such raw voices from readers do not come out of web media."

Funayama: "Recently, there are an increasing number of media outlets that data-mine user behavior, such as reviews and browsing habits, and provide it to advertisers. What do you think about these movements?"

Hirosawa: "To repeat what I said earlier, data mining is also quantitative. On the other hand, the 'readers' I am talking about are qualitative.

The approach of finding unexpected correlations from data mining and thinking about content angles from there is interesting in its own way, and it is an important initiative. However, I think it is dangerous to talk about readers with just that, to talk about readers with only data. Data is different from a reader profile, so I think it's hard to say that you understand the reader profile unless you actually interact with the readers."

Funayama: "In magazine media, readers actually appear in the pages, after all."

Hirosawa: "That's true. I'm not a magazine professional, but I think magazines have a firmer image of their readers."

Funayama: "I think there are ways of talking about readers that are unique to web media, though."

Hirosawa: "As an example, let's talk about the Curel shampoo product I was in charge of before. Suppose a web media representative proposes, 'There are a lot of users and reviews coming in from the search term "dandruff shampoo." So, let's create content for dandruff countermeasures!'

However, given the nature of the product, it's not hard to imagine that people would come in with such search terms. From the advertiser's side, we want to know more about what they are worried about regarding 'dandruff.' Let's say the words 'dandruff middle school student' or 'dandruff child' come up at that time. Even just this can be a hint for a content angle, but to finish it into content that is closer to the reader, if the concrete story of what kind of background they are searching for these words with doesn't come into view, the direction won't be set, and it will become blurred content based only on imagination.
I think it is the voice of the reader that clarifies that. Specifically, it is a way of scooping up the voices of readers through reader interviews or OA. By doing this,
grasping the broad outline of the issue using data, and grasping the story behind it from the voices of the readers, I think that by doing this, you can launch content measures unique to that medium."

Will there be a return to content media in a cookie-less world?

Funayama 'There will be regulations on the use of 3rd Party Cookies in the future, but I think there are many content-based media outlets that have high expectations for that situation.' The idea is that since targeting will also be restricted, direct advertising placements in content media will become popular again. However, I don't think such an optimistic future awaits us. What do you think about this shift from 'people to slots,' Mr. Hirosawa?"

Hirosawa: "I think there is a possibility of a shift from 'people to slots.' There is no doubt that the pros and cons of pure advertising slots will become relatively more important compared to the last five or six years. This is because cookie regulations will also make delivery optimization on platforms more difficult. However, I don't think planning will be limited entirely to pure advertising slots, and targeted delivery will likely remain. The environment that has already progressed will not return to exactly the same state as before. Therefore, as Mr. Funayama says, it is dangerous to be optimistic."

On the other hand, the reason platform advertising has maintained its superiority until now is that its precise targeting and similar features were a major strength. If this advantage wanes and platform advertising also shifts toward prioritizing reach, there is a possibility that TV advertising will be re-evaluated as important. For example, although it's a bit of a rough comparison, if you are using platform advertising to perform delivery focused on impressions with a broad targeting setting like 'interest in beauty,' more advertisers might start thinking that TV advertising is better."

Funayama: "You mentioned that TV advertising is better for broad targeting, but why is that?"

Hirosawa: "With the kind of precise targeting we have now, we can approach active prospects, so we could justify placing ads even if the cost per impression was high. To put it simply, if you are prioritizing reach with rough targeting settings, there are many cases where TV advertising has a lower cost per reach and is more efficient. TV is also making progress with initiatives like Connected TV, and if the differentiation there weakens, it wouldn't be strange for a TV-centric mindset to emerge again."

Beyond knowing the slots and content inside out

Hirosawa: "This was also when I was in charge of Curél, but a senior in the same department decided to buy all the slots they thought were 'the one' as pure advertising. After setting the target audience and communication theme, they stopped all ad networks. It was a small project, so the budget was low, but at that time, the senior personally checked the media content and slots in detail before deciding to place the ads."

Funayama: "What do you mean by 'checked in detail'?"

Hirosawa: "How the ad slots are displayed, and what the user flow is like."

Funayama: "That's amazing! (laughs)"

Hirosawa: "As a result, both CPC and CPA were worse for every slot compared to the ad networks. But that was something we already understood, so I asked the senior, 'How did it go?' based on that.

The reply was,

"Given that the slots I thought were good (from an advertiser's perspective) were surprisingly not clicked on and had poor metrics, they probably weren't very good slots for the readers. I thought they were good because they stood out in terms of UI, but I learned that this isn't where the readers want to look. By comparing the slots one by one again, it gave me an opportunity to think about how the results differ and why they differ.'

they said." Funayama: "That really connects to the story about 'certainty' that you mentioned in

Part 1, Mr. Hirosawa." "Certainty"

Hirosawa: "That's right.

I think media companies should possess this kind of insight themselves. Whether they can manage the position of slots and user flow based on that insight is a major point, and if they can do this, they should be able to monetize their slots even more.

And, as you gain this kind of experience, you will also be able to take orders for slot design from advertisers to media companies.

Of course, there are general patterns for ad slots in the web media industry, and on top of that, UI/UX is evolving day by day, so there is a possibility that ad slot formats that are effective will be determined to some extent.

However, if media professionals who know their own content inside out have deeper insights into ad slot management, interesting ways of showing ads and new initiatives might emerge."

Funayama: "That's true. Unlike TV or print advertising, being able to design the 'slot' itself is unique to the web."

Hirosawa: "By the way, it was my senior who was carefully examining the individual media slots, but I was watching the planning from the side and chiming in, and I enjoyed the feeling of facing the ad slots. (laughs)"

Funayama: "That kind of planning method is rare these days. (laughs) Thank you very much for talking to us about various things today."

What did you think?
We hope that the insights from Mr. Hirosawa, based on his own experience, will be of concrete help to everyone in their content marketing.

LDC will continue to interview key people in the industry and share their insights. Please contact us below for specific inquiries regarding advertising planning.

■Inquiries: ldc@cartahd.com

Author: Takaaki Funayama